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Post by West Acton on Dec 30, 2020 12:33:39 GMT
Given the proper coaching you could turn Dykes from a £1.5 million player into a £10,£15 eventually a £20 million player. He could reach the same levels as Mitrovic of Fulham, at least, within a couple of seasons, pretty quickly. If you know how to do it. RS while I have a hole in my arse Dykes will not be worth 20mil |
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Post by Shania on Dec 30, 2020 12:34:29 GMT
That is true. It would have been great if he was brought in to work with the senior pros. He’s been busy with the youngsters Shania. Teaching the likes of Chair how not to take free kicks and corners.😂 Could be   |
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Post by rscot on Dec 30, 2020 12:36:47 GMT
Given good coaching, yes he could be. That’s my opinion, and I’d be more than happy to back it up, if anyone from QPR thinks I don’t know what I’m talking about
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Post by BrightonR on Dec 30, 2020 12:44:07 GMT
Agree about getting runners around him to flick onto etc that’s correct but what about bringing the ball down and protecting it (Hughill, heider or Zamora style) and bringing others into the game or winning a freekick Can anyone honestly say he’s shown any sign, given his size and stature, of being able to do that? Yes we probably can make him play bit better by getting people around him but surely there is responsibility on himself to also make himself look good/better by doing what I’ve just suggested. Plant your feet make the ball hit your chest then give it or the cb comes over the top of you and you Nick a freekick He rarely even gives a foul away against him which tells me he’s not actually challenging or battling for the ball. He can do way more then he’s showing currently so if he’s been evaluated harshly by some fans large part of that is down to himself. Not defending him, but I get extremely wound up by forwards losing us possession by fouling defenders in and around the opposition’s box. And poor old Matt Smith was regularly getting penalised for being fouled. ☹️ |
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Post by rscot on Dec 30, 2020 13:00:23 GMT
Stan not everything needs to be coached somethings you just do. He’s a professional international footballer. You learn the game as a kid and you perfect it as an adult I think on occasions it’s bit lazy to blame coaching for short comings sometimes you have to look at the individual and say do you actually want to do it? If he’s not learnt to plant his feet at 25years of age I’m not sure any amount of coaching will teach him that as he should have learned it in the parl. I say that about Dykes but that could apply to any of our players who are coming up short ie Chair being unable to use his left foot It depends on the situation, Dykes is mobile with pace for a guy at 6 2 or 6 3, ideally he doesn’t want to plant his feet in the middle 1/3 of the pitch. He wants to play the ball off quickly , then get turned and get to opposition 18 yard line. There is where he wants to plant his feet, and have the ball played into him, and then play through a runner, link up etc |
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Post by 1973ranger on Dec 30, 2020 13:15:22 GMT
Agree about getting runners around him to flick onto etc that’s correct but what about bringing the ball down and protecting it (Hughill, heider or Zamora style) and bringing others into the game or winning a freekick Can anyone honestly say he’s shown any sign, given his size and stature, of being able to do that? Yes we probably can make him play bit better by getting people around him but surely there is responsibility on himself to also make himself look good/better by doing what I’ve just suggested. Plant your feet make the ball hit your chest then give it or the cb comes over the top of you and you Nick a freekick He rarely even gives a foul away against him which tells me he’s not actually challenging or battling for the ball. He can do way more then he’s showing currently so if he’s been evaluated harshly by some fans large part of that is down to himself. Agree with you Wests, and that is the basics for a striker of his build - which begs the question why doesn't he do it? You then have to ask if he's being coached to do it. And again we come back to the manager, his coaches and their seeming incompetence. Dykes more than most will need coaching as he was a late starter in football terms as played Rugby League in Australia. We have a forward who is mobile and willing now we need to teach him and if we do then he will prove to be an asset. McBurnie went for 18 to 20 million 18 months ago yet Clarke picks Dykes over him for Scotland. Steve Clarke is a very good coach so maybe that is why Dykes has done well for Scotland and not as well for us. |
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Post by rscot on Dec 30, 2020 13:26:52 GMT
Agree with you Wests, and that is the basics for a striker of his build - which begs the question why doesn't he do it? You then have to ask if he's being coached to do it. And again we come back to the manager, his coaches and their seeming incompetence. Dykes more than most will need coaching as he was a late starter in football terms as played Rugby League in Australia. We have a forward who is mobile and willing now we need to teach him and if we do then he will prove to be an asset. McBurnie went for 18 to 20 million 18 months ago yet Clarke picks Dykes over him for Scotland. Steve Clarke is a very good coach so maybe that is why Dykes has done well for Scotland and not as well for us. His technique just needs some polishing, wouldn’t take me long to put him on the right track, trajectory |
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Post by alanwycombe on Dec 30, 2020 13:57:53 GMT
I'm definitely with Westy on this one. You can't teach ability, you can coach how to use it but if you haven't got it improvement will be negligible. You can improve BOS with coaching because he needs to learn when to release the ball, when to cross, but he has the skill to do it. The ball doesn't stick to Dykes, his first touch is awful and he doesn't win much in the air. He looks lost most of the time and if you do believe he can be coached then it won't be by someone who has sat on his box watching Chair fuck up every dead ball for half a season.
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Post by 1973ranger on Dec 30, 2020 14:06:23 GMT
Not saying he is a world beater but he is better for Scotland than us and does look more dangerous as well. Could it be that Clarke gives him a clear role to carry out with support around him. Agree you cannot teach ability but you can improve what ability you do have with good coaching
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Post by rscot on Dec 30, 2020 14:08:09 GMT
I disagree, there is this myth about football that it’s all natural talent/ability. Look at other sports for example, Andy Murray got coaches to specifically help him with his serve, he improved, he went on to win Wimbledon. Tyson Fury, the best heavyweight for a long time (possibly all time), went to the Kronk gym to work on and improve certain techniques within his game. Nick Faldo spent years rebuilding his swing so he could play and win links competitions. Technique in football can be worked on and improved in a systematic manner and when working with players at the level of BOS, Chair, Dykes etc, ie people who aren’t starting from scratch, it would be fairly easy and the improvements would be seen quickly.
Again anyone from QPR thinks I’m talking shit, put your money on the table and make me prove it.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 30, 2020 14:12:43 GMT
I'm definitely with Westy on this one. You can't teach ability, you can coach how to use it but if you haven't got it improvement will be negligible. You can improve BOS with coaching because he needs to learn when to release the ball, when to cross, but he has the skill to do it. The ball doesn't stick to Dykes, his first touch is awful and he doesn't win much in the air. He looks lost most of the time and if you do believe he can be coached then it won't be by someone who has sat on his box watching Chair fuck up every dead ball for half a season. I thought we might all turn over a new leaf where the club and Mwarb were concerned..at least for a few hours.😂 |
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Post by alanwycombe on Dec 30, 2020 14:12:51 GMT
Don't know who you are mate but if you can turn Dykes from 2 Bob to £20m you should be knocking Les' door down not wasting your time on here. Make sure you're on a cut though.
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Post by alanwycombe on Dec 30, 2020 14:17:54 GMT
I'm definitely with Westy on this one. You can't teach ability, you can coach how to use it but if you haven't got it improvement will be negligible. You can improve BOS with coaching because he needs to learn when to release the ball, when to cross, but he has the skill to do it. The ball doesn't stick to Dykes, his first touch is awful and he doesn't win much in the air. He looks lost most of the time and if you do believe he can be coached then it won't be by someone who has sat on his box watching Chair fuck up every dead ball for half a season. I thought we might all turn over a new leaf where the club and Mwarb were concerned..at least for a few hours.😂 Or until you look at the table... 😂 |
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Post by rscot on Dec 30, 2020 14:20:53 GMT
Try getting into football if you’re not already involved. That’s one of the major reasons football in Scotland/England has been so poor over the 30 years. No new people with new ideas. I know what I can do, I know my ideas/techniques work. Lots of things I don’t know about football, especially all the nutrition, eating, sports science etc. But football technique, I know well, I know how to teach and improve in a quick, systematic manner.
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Post by West Acton on Dec 30, 2020 14:25:18 GMT
Sound like uri geller
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Post by rscot on Dec 30, 2020 14:28:01 GMT
Quite the opposite, my methods are systematic, quantifiable, verifiable unlike others who believe that controlling a football is some mystic art. Although there is an interesting link between technique and imagination, that’s where the “magic” is |
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Post by Shania on Dec 30, 2020 14:37:05 GMT
I'm definitely with Westy on this one. You can't teach ability, you can coach how to use it but if you haven't got it improvement will be negligible. You can improve BOS with coaching because he needs to learn when to release the ball, when to cross, but he has the skill to do it. The ball doesn't stick to Dykes, his first touch is awful and he doesn't win much in the air. He looks lost most of the time and if you do believe he can be coached then it won't be by someone who has sat on his box watching Chair fuck up every dead ball for half a season. Of course you can. What do you think they have coaches for? Besides: Many attackers do individual training also. |
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Post by rscot on Dec 30, 2020 14:42:01 GMT
I'm definitely with Westy on this one. You can't teach ability, you can coach how to use it but if you haven't got it improvement will be negligible. You can improve BOS with coaching because he needs to learn when to release the ball, when to cross, but he has the skill to do it. The ball doesn't stick to Dykes, his first touch is awful and he doesn't win much in the air. He looks lost most of the time and if you do believe he can be coached then it won't be by someone who has sat on his box watching Chair fuck up every dead ball for half a season. Of course you can. What do you think they have coaches for? Besides: Many attackers do individual training also. I agree Shania, but it is my belief, going from what I see with my eyes, the techniques, methods they are using are poor and slow. I can improve technique drastically and quickly in players that are already at a good/high level of ability/technique |
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Post by 1973ranger on Dec 30, 2020 14:57:54 GMT
Of course you can. What do you think they have coaches for? Besides: Many attackers do individual training also. I agree Shania, but it is my belief, going from what I see with my eyes, the techniques, methods they are using are poor and slow. I can improve technique drastically and quickly in players that are already at a good/high level of ability/technique You cannot teach ability but you can maximise the ability that a player has. You can work and drill the less naturally gifted players and see the improvement come and them develop into a technically better player. |
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Post by alanwycombe on Dec 30, 2020 15:05:25 GMT
I've got nothing to offer the pro game, I mostly marvel at what they can do, but I've been comparing and contrasting for a long time and sometimes I can't understand how someone has made it to the top level. I don't see Dykes as a championship player.
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Post by rscot on Dec 30, 2020 15:09:32 GMT
I agree Shania, but it is my belief, going from what I see with my eyes, the techniques, methods they are using are poor and slow. I can improve technique drastically and quickly in players that are already at a good/high level of ability/technique You cannot teach ability but you can maximise the ability that a player has. You can work and drill the less naturally gifted players and see the improvement come and them develop into a technically better player. Mmmm technique/ability getting slightly confusing with the use of these terms. It’s not as black and white as you make out. In my previous post I mentioned “that there was an interesting link/relationship between technique and imagination”. I’m sure there are lots of people who have played football that have tried to perform a move, pass etc. which they had imagined, pictured in their mind, but their technique failed them. Now if I can (and I can) improve your technique, doesn’t that then allow you to play in a more imaginative manner, because it allows you to do what you’ve pictured in your mind confident that your technique will allow it. After confidence in your technique grows wouldn’t this feed back into your imagination allowing you to think about playing in more imaginative/inventive ways? I think so, there’s a symbiotic relationship between technique and imagination. |
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Post by alanwycombe on Dec 30, 2020 15:10:56 GMT
I'm definitely with Westy on this one. You can't teach ability, you can coach how to use it but if you haven't got it improvement will be negligible. You can improve BOS with coaching because he needs to learn when to release the ball, when to cross, but he has the skill to do it. The ball doesn't stick to Dykes, his first touch is awful and he doesn't win much in the air. He looks lost most of the time and if you do believe he can be coached then it won't be by someone who has sat on his box watching Chair fuck up every dead ball for half a season. Of course you can. What do you think they have coaches for? Besides: Many attackers do individual training also. You have coaches to channel ability Shania. If you can't kick a ball no one will turn you into a top player. Very few young players are retained from youth set ups, they only keep the ones with most potential not the ones they hope they can coach beyond their ability. |
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Post by 1973ranger on Dec 30, 2020 15:11:50 GMT
I've got nothing to offer the pro game, I mostly marvel at what they can do, but I've been comparing and contrasting for a long time and sometimes I can't understand how someone has made it to the top level. I don't see Dykes as a championship player. I think he can be but is very raw and needs working with. I have watched him for Scotland and looks comfortable at that level in a team that has a system that he knows and plays a vital part in it. We have a very one paced and ordinary midfield who to be fair have never made our forwards look good. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 30, 2020 15:19:16 GMT
What about Bonne...is he capable at Championship level...I would say he’s similar to Dykes in that he’s shown very little.
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Post by rscot on Dec 30, 2020 15:22:03 GMT
Of course you can. What do you think they have coaches for? Besides: Many attackers do individual training also. You have coaches to channel ability Shania. If you can't kick a ball no one will turn you into a top player. Very few young players are retained from youth set ups, they only keep the ones with most potential not the ones they hope they can coach beyond their ability. First thing, you’ve got to want it, work for it, put the time, effort etc into it. I agree no one can teach, force that. But we are talking about professionals here, people who have clearly dedicated large parts of their life to the game and have reached a level. What I’m talking about is polishing up their technique, not starting from scratch. |
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Post by West Acton on Dec 30, 2020 15:44:33 GMT
What about Bonne...is he capable at Championship level...I would say he’s similar to Dykes in that he’s shown very little. if RS gets his hands on him there is no limit to his progression Real Madrid awaits 😁 |
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Post by rscot on Dec 30, 2020 15:50:48 GMT
What about Bonne...is he capable at Championship level...I would say he’s similar to Dykes in that he’s shown very little. if RS gets his hands on him there is no limit to his progression Real Madrid awaits 😁 Mmmm technique/ability getting slightly confusing with the use of these terms. It’s not as black and white as you make out. In my previous post I mentioned “that there was an interesting link/relationship between technique and imagination”. I’m sure there are lots of people who have played football that have tried to perform a move, pass etc. which they had imagined, pictured in their mind, but their technique failed them. Now if I can (and I can) improve your technique, doesn’t that then allow you to play in a more imaginative manner, because it allows you to do what you’ve pictured in your mind confident that your technique will allow it. After confidence in your technique grows wouldn’t this feed back into your imagination allowing you to think about playing in more imaginative/inventive ways? I think so, there’s a symbiotic relationship between technique and imagination Have you ever heard anyone else talk about football technique/ability in this manner? I’m gonna guess that you haven’t, so where did it come from, did I just make it up, OR did I work it out for myself? |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 30, 2020 15:59:45 GMT
Being realistic with what we paid for Dykes and Bonne what strikers in the championship stand out as the Gold Standard.
I could only think of Toney ,Wells or maybe Hughill at a push but all were out of our price range in transfer and wages.
Toney has been round the block at loads of smaller clubs before having a breakthrough season at Posh.
Forgot Pooki
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Post by alanwycombe on Dec 30, 2020 16:07:30 GMT
In all my years of watching Rangers I have only ever seen one player achieve beyond expectations and go from zero to hero - I will stand corrected by other older guys on here but... Mick Leach. To begin with there were groans when his name was announced but he ended up holding his own in a team of internationals. He had limited ability but Sexton helped him achieve a level of consistency so you always knew what you were going to get and that became a key role in the team. Now, compare and contrast... MW is no Sexton and Dykes is no Leach.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 30, 2020 16:15:45 GMT
In all my years of watching Rangers I have only ever seen one player achieve beyond expectations and go from zero to hero - I will stand corrected by other older guys on here but... Mick Leach. To begin with there were groans when his name was announced but he ended up holding his own in a team of internationals. He had limited ability but Sexton helped him achieve a level of consistency so you always knew what you were going to get and that became a key role in the team. Now, compare and contrast... MW is no Sexton and Dykes is no Leach. I can remember Leach and got to be honest my Father always shouted abuse at him so I did.too. Alan Wilkes was another frustrating player who was similar in that he divided the fan base. Despite many other opinions I see now Simon Barker was another who very limited in my book but rated by many. |
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