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Post by West Acton on May 22, 2024 9:28:52 GMT
Whilst they have made some horrific decisions I must say they have stood firm by us and we could be in worse hands when compared to others like Reading and Sheff Wednesday
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Post by Ginger Ninja on May 22, 2024 10:53:16 GMT
Is that not against FFP rules?
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Post by James1979 on May 22, 2024 11:47:02 GMT
Is that not against FFP rules? No issue with doing it but you just don’t get any benefit under FFP. |
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Post by The General on May 22, 2024 11:56:43 GMT
Is that 5.6 million or 56 million
Think its the former
And who owns these shares now ?
Amit
Ruben
Yankee
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Post by The General on May 22, 2024 11:58:36 GMT
I honestly think that the club is now in good hands
New young ceo seems very ambitious and astute
All the free loaders have gone
Good signings so far very good
Top half next year keep building
League is getting harder and harder though
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Post by The General on May 22, 2024 11:59:14 GMT
We are a club again not a rich man’s play thing
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Post by spongeparr on May 22, 2024 13:42:38 GMT
Is that not against FFP rules? No issue with doing it but you just don’t get any benefit under FFP. This is probably me being silly but why can't they spend £100m and convert that into shares? |
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Post by The General on May 22, 2024 14:07:28 GMT
No issue with doing it but you just don’t get any benefit under FFP. This is probably me being silly but why can't they spend £100m and convert that into shares? They have mate spent 200 million now on shares It’s called debt spongey |
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Post by hal9thou on May 22, 2024 14:59:10 GMT
Is that not against FFP rules? No issue with doing it but you just don’t get any benefit under FFP. Just to say that nothing has really changed, we've done this before - it does theoretically help FFP by reducing debt, although obviously you still need to find capital to do business. |
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Post by spongeparr on May 22, 2024 15:50:17 GMT
This is probably me being silly but why can't they spend £100m and convert that into shares? They have mate spent 200 million now on shares It’s called debt spongey What I mean is, why can't we spend 100m on someone and then just turn that debt into shares? |
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Post by The General on May 22, 2024 15:53:38 GMT
Mmm interesting proposal
Not sure on this
Buy Eze back 🤣
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Post by Corbray on May 22, 2024 17:48:23 GMT
They have mate spent 200 million now on shares It’s called debt spongey What I mean is, why can't we spend 100m on someone and then just turn that debt into shares? coz the converted shares are converted from debt that the club has to our owners. the owners are basically hyperinflating their own shares from the money that they're putting in. so if you have a thousand shares worth a quid each but then split those shares into 2000 they're only worth 50p each. it's a quick solution to debt tbh, the shares might be near worthless ATM but if we go up and become a stable prem club the shares would end up being worth much more. the reason why we can't just convert transfer debt is because it's money that the club owes to someone else. |
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Post by hal9thou on May 22, 2024 18:19:53 GMT
What I mean is, why can't we spend 100m on someone and then just turn that debt into shares? coz the converted shares are converted from debt that the club has to our owners. the reason why we can't just convert transfer debt is because it's money that the club owes to someone else. exactly this |
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Post by spongeparr on May 22, 2024 18:43:14 GMT
What I mean is, why can't we spend 100m on someone and then just turn that debt into shares? coz the converted shares are converted from debt that the club has to our owners. the owners are basically hyperinflating their own shares from the money that they're putting in. so if you have a thousand shares worth a quid each but then split those shares into 2000 they're only worth 50p each. it's a quick solution to debt tbh, the shares might be near worthless ATM but if we go up and become a stable prem club the shares would end up being worth much more. the reason why we can't just convert transfer debt is because it's money that the club owes to someone else. My knowledge of this is zero so I appreciate you going through it. the bit that still confuses me about that is couldn’t Ruben loan the club 100m and then the club is in debt to him rather than to the club we buy from? I know we can’t and there is a reason, I’m just not smart enough to work out the difference. |
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Post by James1979 on May 22, 2024 18:48:49 GMT
No issue with doing it but you just don’t get any benefit under FFP. Just to say that nothing has really changed, we've done this before - it does theoretically help FFP by reducing debt, although obviously you still need to find capital to do business. FFP is on your net losses. Nothing to do with debt. Shareholder debt isn’t really debt either |
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Post by West Acton on May 22, 2024 18:51:04 GMT
coz the converted shares are converted from debt that the club has to our owners. the owners are basically hyperinflating their own shares from the money that they're putting in. so if you have a thousand shares worth a quid each but then split those shares into 2000 they're only worth 50p each. it's a quick solution to debt tbh, the shares might be near worthless ATM but if we go up and become a stable prem club the shares would end up being worth much more. the reason why we can't just convert transfer debt is because it's money that the club owes to someone else. My knowledge of this is zero so I appreciate you going through it. the bit that still confuses me about that is couldn’t Ruben loan the club 100m and then the club is in debt to him rather than to the club we buy from? I know we can’t and there is a reason, I’m just not smart enough to work out the difference. I thought the same |
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Post by James1979 on May 22, 2024 18:51:58 GMT
No issue with doing it but you just don’t get any benefit under FFP. This is probably me being silly but why can't they spend £100m and convert that into shares? If they spend 100m, that would be expense of 100m that goes through the profit and loss. The max you can over 3 years is about 40m. So we’re breach and be fined, lose points, get relegated etc |
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Post by James1979 on May 22, 2024 18:56:11 GMT
coz the converted shares are converted from debt that the club has to our owners. the owners are basically hyperinflating their own shares from the money that they're putting in. so if you have a thousand shares worth a quid each but then split those shares into 2000 they're only worth 50p each. it's a quick solution to debt tbh, the shares might be near worthless ATM but if we go up and become a stable prem club the shares would end up being worth much more. the reason why we can't just convert transfer debt is because it's money that the club owes to someone else. My knowledge of this is zero so I appreciate you going through it. the bit that still confuses me about that is couldn’t Ruben loan the club 100m and then the club is in debt to him rather than to the club we buy from? I know we can’t and there is a reason, I’m just not smart enough to work out the difference. Think about ffp as setting a limit on the amount you can lose as a business. Or in other words, the amount you sell (revenue) less your costs. If an owner puts in money, that isn’t revenue. |
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Post by Corbray on May 22, 2024 19:01:08 GMT
coz the converted shares are converted from debt that the club has to our owners. the owners are basically hyperinflating their own shares from the money that they're putting in. so if you have a thousand shares worth a quid each but then split those shares into 2000 they're only worth 50p each. it's a quick solution to debt tbh, the shares might be near worthless ATM but if we go up and become a stable prem club the shares would end up being worth much more. the reason why we can't just convert transfer debt is because it's money that the club owes to someone else. My knowledge of this is zero so I appreciate you going through it. the bit that still confuses me about that is couldn’t Ruben loan the club 100m and then the club is in debt to him rather than to the club we buy from? I know we can’t and there is a reason, I’m just not smart enough to work out the difference. afaik that would break FFP and is the very thing the FA has been trying to get away from. what if reuben suddenly decided to call in his loans for example or the club couldn't make payments on the loan that reuben wrote up? it's about sustainability and protecting clubs. bolton, blackpool and portsmouth all got fucked over by bad owners using their clubs as piggy banks or needing the club to bail them out when their other endeavours went tits up. sure, you can get an owner like jack walker who wants nothing more than to take the hit and bring success to his boyhood club. but you can also get owners who want to make a profit from their club and strip them like the glazers have at utd. FFP is a great idea but it's just been implemented poorly and can keep smaller clubs down. but tbh i'd rather have QPR be a championship club for the next 100 years than spend big, go into the prem/europe and cease to exist within 25 years because of poor financial management and overspending. owners can walk away at anytime after all. i appreciate what the board do, yes they have fucked up royally but at least they still keep us afloat and are out of pocket from doing so. they're good people, stupid, but good. they're converting the debt into shares so we don't actually owe them money. they're the ones taking the hit, sure it might work out in years to come but if it doesn't they're left holding onto shares that are worth 0.01p a share. |
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Post by Stanley75 on May 22, 2024 19:38:40 GMT
they're converting the debt into shares so we don't actually owe them money. they're the ones taking the hit, sure it might work out in years to come but if it doesn't they're left holding onto shares that are worth 0.01p a share. But what would they be worth if Marti got us promoted? Unlikely but not beyond the realms of possibility either. |
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Post by James1979 on May 22, 2024 19:55:39 GMT
they're converting the debt into shares so we don't actually owe them money. they're the ones taking the hit, sure it might work out in years to come but if it doesn't they're left holding onto shares that are worth 0.01p a share. But what would they be worth if Marti got us promoted? Unlikely but not beyond the realms of possibility either. Who knows but value would increase significantly because of future income and imagine our player values. |
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Post by hal9thou on May 23, 2024 10:12:29 GMT
Just to say that nothing has really changed, we've done this before - it does theoretically help FFP by reducing debt, although obviously you still need to find capital to do business. FFP is on your net losses. Nothing to do with debt. Shareholder debt isn’t really debt either You're absolutely correct and average debt actually increased by 48% (ie massively beyond inflation) in the years after the introduction of FFP, thereby demonstrating one of the scheme's many failings. However, UEFA's sustainability regulations do seek to protect creditors (albeit real world debt to genuine creditors rather than shareholders). And what UEFA do inevitably ends up being implEmented by the authorities over here. |
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Post by West Acton on Jun 1, 2024 17:22:58 GMT
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Post by West Acton on Jun 3, 2024 12:10:38 GMT
We’re getting very organised and technical
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Post by loneranger80 on Jun 3, 2024 12:13:19 GMT
who carried out these roles last season??
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Post by alanwycombe on Jun 3, 2024 13:44:39 GMT
who carried out these roles last season?? Set pieces? Err……..? |
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Post by Corbray on Jun 3, 2024 14:18:11 GMT
xavi calm was supposed to be something of a set piece and defensive specialist. modern game calls for these set piece coaches nowadays, look at how many points spurs dropped on set pieces due to ange having no interest in set pieces.
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Post by West Acton on Jun 5, 2024 16:21:09 GMT
Tony F doing a Flavio
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Post by 2Loftus on Jun 5, 2024 17:07:47 GMT
Just copied/pasted the main bits of that longish thread Westie...
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Post by jfrabbit on Jun 19, 2024 16:10:26 GMT
Fair comment  |
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