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Post by gloucesterr on Aug 22, 2019 7:09:18 GMT
Before I get shot down I do not mean if we lose we are in trouble or anything like that. However fans have been optimistic on the back of playing nice football, the confidence is in the squad, however a defeat on Saturday and the numbers following the side away will fall again and the confidence will start to .
I wouldn't make sweeping changes but I think a couple have to be made, would start with BFG, Chair, Pugh and Ball dropping out Amos (assume injured), Smith, Bright and Barbie.
Lumley
Kane Hall BFG Manning
Cameron Ball
Pugh Eze Chair
Hugil
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Post by Stanley75 on Aug 22, 2019 7:18:02 GMT
Bright on the wing has been absolute dynamite recently, terrifying defenders - particularly at Bristol and last night. So would be reluctant to drop him, but can definitely see the case for Pugh and Chair starting now. If Wallace is fit he should be starting too.
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Post by James1979 on Aug 22, 2019 7:24:13 GMT
Not a must win for me but agree with few changes:
Kelly Kane, Hall, Barbet, Wallace/Manning Chair, Ball, Cameron BOS, Hugill, Eze
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Post by spongeparr on Aug 22, 2019 7:24:39 GMT
I thought Brighr and Chair had a really good link up. Would like to see Eze (my MOTM yesterday) BOS and Chair up top. I think Pugh could play alongside a holding midfielder just behind.
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Post by Tarbie on Aug 22, 2019 7:28:50 GMT
I think both Amos and Cameron will be doubtful for the weekend mate.
Personally I'd drop BOS. The guy has no end product. Pugh and chair are both much smarter players.
How we sort out the keeper and back 4 is much more of a conundrum. I think a change in mentality/tactics is required, but I'd assume Warburton will want to continue trying to play a high line and play it out from the back.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2019 7:32:58 GMT
Suicide playing out with a high with the players we have, Get a win and do the basics well and things will take shape. Basic defensive mistakes are undoing all the good attacking work.
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Post by gloucesterr on Aug 22, 2019 7:45:17 GMT
I like BOS but agree with Tarbie on end product, I just think we need to look after the ball better and Pugh and Chair would offer that.
None of the back 4 covered themselves in glory last night, Kane quick and mobile but gave the ball away alot, the gap between Hall and Barbet was big enough for Troy Deeney's backside and far too open. Lumley seems to have slump in form but I say nothing from Kelly in pre-season that made me think he would be any better.
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Post by esoxlucius on Aug 22, 2019 7:48:02 GMT
Saturday is NOT a must win game FFS. BOS terrifies defenders and does enough to keep their defenders in their own half. Let's not write him off just yet. Too many knee jerk reactions.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2019 7:49:46 GMT
All home games for me are must win.
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Post by gloucesterr on Aug 22, 2019 8:02:12 GMT
Esoxlucius for a start look at me reasons for saying a must win, confidence will fade away and we get stuck in a rut plus the goodwill from the fans will fade as well. Last year the atmosphere at HQ was poor and our away following wasn't great either.
No one writing BOS off and has pace and skill but end product is lacking, we need players who look after the ball as no one can deny we have a very soft underbelly!
So no knee jerk reactions we are finding out best 11 but there are a few that have not turned up for a couple of games in a row now and the 2 players for every position only works if you use them. Take Ball, looked good all pre season, missed one game due to suspension and GC played well, no arguments about being on the bench. Since then GC poor at Brizzle and so poor last night pulled at HT. MW stated all summer no one is guaranteed a shirt we have cover all over and will be performance based.
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Post by esoxlucius on Aug 22, 2019 8:02:24 GMT
All home games for me are must win. Well you are watching the wrong team; expect a lot of disappointment and heartache this season then.
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Post by esoxlucius on Aug 22, 2019 8:08:03 GMT
Esoxlucius for a start look at me reasons for saying a must win, confidence will fade away and we get stuck in a rut plus the goodwill from the fans will fade as well. Last year the atmosphere at HQ was poor and our away following wasn't great either. No one writing BOS off and has pace and skill but end product is lacking, we need players who look after the ball as no one can deny we have a very soft underbelly! So no knee jerk reactions we are finding out best 11 but there are a few that have not turned up for a couple of games in a row now and the 2 players for every position only works if you use them. Take Ball, looked good all pre season, missed one game due to suspension and GC played well, no arguments about being on the bench. Since then GC poor at Brizzle and so poor last night pulled at HT. MW stated all summer no one is guaranteed a shirt we have cover all over and will be performance based. Most of that post is erroneous. ALL the players are turning up at each and every game. Errors and mistakes will happen as a group of new players learn the system and get to know each other. AFAIK Cameron went off injured after picking up what appeared to be a strain injury after 20 mins. Before that he was having an excellent game and that Cryuff turn and raking cross field pass to BOS? was sublime. What was it about a new manager and new team full of kids, freebies and loanees made you think that we would be the next Man City? Try looking at the positives; we are four points better off than we were at this stage last year with a settled, and more expensive team.
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Post by gloucesterr on Aug 22, 2019 8:27:30 GMT
Who mentioned Man City? Fully aware we have been assembled on a budget but hardly a side full of Kids! Kane, Hall, Barbet, Hugil, Scowen, Lumley - all mid to late 20's, Cameron mid 30's. I rate GC but was poor at BC and i disagree on last night IMO he was not playing well before the injury, he is in the team to sit and protect the CB's.
There are positives as pointed out in the original post but we have a soft under belly, played some great football but not great in the final 3rd. 4 league games played scored 3 conceded 7 would back that up.
Some tweaks to the line up to freshen things up and give those chomping at the bit a chance is not a bad think.
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Post by esoxlucius on Aug 22, 2019 9:24:44 GMT
Who mentioned Man City? Fully aware we have been assembled on a budget but hardly a side full of Kids! Kane, Hall, Barbet, Hugil, Scowen, Lumley - all mid to late 20's, Cameron mid 30's. I rate GC but was poor at BC and i disagree on last night IMO he was not playing well before the injury, he is in the team to sit and protect the CB's. There are positives as pointed out in the original post but we have a soft under belly, played some great football but not great in the final 3rd. 4 league games played scored 3 conceded 7 would back that up. Some tweaks to the line up to freshen things up and give those chomping at the bit a chance is not a bad think. You must have missed Cameron's Cryuff turn and pinged cross field pass to BOS/Kane? in the first ten minutes then. Couple with that was some good break up play and tidy passing. It all went down hill for him when he tweaked his hammy chasing back for the first goal. Also, I didn't say a team full of kids, read what I said again.
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Post by shepherdsmush on Aug 22, 2019 10:39:57 GMT
I'd call it a must win because a) it is against one of the perceived weaker sides in the division, b) it is at home and c) like last season it could be the catalyst we need to push on
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Post by hubble on Aug 22, 2019 10:47:32 GMT
None of the above makes Saturday's game a 'must win'. I think, at this stage in the season, it's a 'would be bloody good to win' game - obviously - but talk about 'must win' games at this point, whatever the reasoning, is absurd, IMHO.
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Post by Stanley75 on Aug 22, 2019 10:49:22 GMT
Interestingly Wigan at home last season was the catalyst for our turning point. Let's hope history repeats and it's a good omen!
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Post by shepherdsmush on Aug 22, 2019 10:55:25 GMT
"Who have you got on Saturday?" "Wigan at home" "You must win that surely?"
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Post by acricketer on Aug 22, 2019 12:35:57 GMT
"Who have you got on Saturday?" "Wigan at home" "You must win that surely?" Don't call me Shirley!
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Post by Shania on Aug 22, 2019 13:08:09 GMT
Esoxlucius for a start look at me reasons for saying a must win, confidence will fade away and we get stuck in a rut plus the goodwill from the fans will fade as well. Last year the atmosphere at HQ was poor and our away following wasn't great either.No one writing BOS off and has pace and skill but end product is lacking, we need players who look after the ball as no one can deny we have a very soft underbelly! So no knee jerk reactions we are finding out best 11 but there are a few that have not turned up for a couple of games in a row now and the 2 players for every position only works if you use them. Take Ball, looked good all pre season, missed one game due to suspension and GC played well, no arguments about being on the bench. Since then GC poor at Brizzle and so poor last night pulled at HT. MW stated all summer no one is guaranteed a shirt we have cover all over and will be performance based. This time we have be smarter than giving up on our team so soon. Chanching another manager is that a solution? IMO, we have to trust Warburton even if it means a seaason in div. 1. Having said this; last night`s match actually made me cry when Barbet gave away a penalty.
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Post by gloucesterr on Aug 22, 2019 13:13:27 GMT
Dont think anyone spoke about giving up or changing manager. I wanted Warburton and happy we got him. But just mean not open to slight criticism if continues to persist with something that isnt working.
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Post by alanwycombe on Aug 22, 2019 13:15:38 GMT
No, this idea you have to go backwards to go forwards is a myth. I think Warburton is a step forward and won't take us down but if you do get relegated you lose money, fans and you don't attract decent players. It's a long way back that's why panic sets in at clubs threatened with relegation - Burnley perhaps the only exception. The last thing our club needs is third tier football.
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Post by Shania on Aug 22, 2019 13:25:20 GMT
Dont think anyone spoke about giving up or changing manager. I wanted Warburton and happy we got him. But just mean not open to slight criticism if continues to persist with something that isnt working. OK.
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Post by Shania on Aug 22, 2019 13:28:49 GMT
No, this idea you have to go backwards to go forwards is a myth. I think Warburton is a step forward and won't take us down but if you do get relegated you lose money, fans and you don't attract decent players. It's a long way back that's why panic sets in at clubs threatened with relegation - Burnley perhaps the only exception. The last thing our club needs is third tier football. It is more the fact that this appointment has to be a success, we simply cannot fire him..
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Post by esoxlucius on Aug 22, 2019 13:46:05 GMT
No, this idea you have to go backwards to go forwards is a myth. I think Warburton is a step forward and won't take us down but if you do get relegated you lose money, fans and you don't attract decent players. It's a long way back that's why panic sets in at clubs threatened with relegation - Burnley perhaps the only exception. The last thing our club needs is third tier football. or another round of sack the manager after some bad results and start over again.
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Post by shepherdsmush on Aug 22, 2019 13:51:49 GMT
Not sure how we got on to Warbs out but that is ludicrous.
From what I've seen, we play a decent style and have some fairly decent players BUT we are defensively naive and will be proper cannon fodder for the better teams in this division if we don't get some steel into the side.
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Post by esoxlucius on Aug 22, 2019 14:19:12 GMT
Not sure how we got on to Warbs out but that is ludicrous. From what I've seen, we play a decent style and have some fairly decent players BUT we are defensively naive and will be proper cannon fodder for the better teams in this division if we don't get some steel into the side. We currently don't have the money, or the opportunity to do anything other than use the squad we have. Some games we WILL be cannon fodder as we can't compete with those teams at the moment. That's the time to put on your big girl pants, suck it up and move on to the next game. This team, despite a much more attractive style of playing, is far from good enough to compete with a lot of the teams, accept that, support our players and look ahead to the day when we are good enough to hold our own against the best again.
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Post by gloucesterr on Aug 22, 2019 14:44:18 GMT
I don't buy that as a squad we are not good enough to compete, championship spending is down this year. We haven't spent a lot but been very smart with our recruitment. Teams have gone up on similar budgets in the past by being well managed.
I backed us at the bookies and on loft for words to be top 6. I see nothing in this league we should be scared of and believe we are capable of challenging. My point being all along yes good football, soft under belly and not clinical, continue to drop points and how long before the football fades too?? We have all been Rangers fans long enough to have seen that happen.
It is also a danger when have multiple loan signings in the squad, last season when we lost our form, the football was terrible and Hemed and Wells looked like they would rather be somewhere else.
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Post by Stanley75 on Aug 22, 2019 14:45:12 GMT
we are defensively naive and will be proper cannon fodder for the better teams in this division if we don't get some steel into the side. BFG certainly provides steel.
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Post by gloucesterr on Aug 22, 2019 14:46:46 GMT
And last post wasn't negative and back to the original post a tweak here and there is what is needed not wholesale surgery. The one criticism we heard from fans of previous MW clubs was he was stubborn with selection and formation.
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