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Post by Tarbie on Apr 17, 2022 11:29:42 GMT
This argument around position in the league vs money spent is all well and good until you look at the table and see Luton and Huddersfield in play off contention.
I don't know why we are so keen to make excuses for Warburton. The bottom line is he's preceded over our biggest collapse from a promising position in decades and the way he's done it is by making exactly the same mistakes that he has been making all through his tenure and at other clubs before that.
I have no issues with anyone saying that this season's return is fine by them and the are happy to stick with this manager and have the same frustrations next season. Anyone who genuinely wants progress must surely see that this guy has run his course?
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awin
Silver Seat
Posts: 1,768
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Post by awin on Apr 17, 2022 11:32:41 GMT
This argument around position in the league vs money spent is all well and good until you look at the table and see Luton and Huddersfield in play off contention. I don't know why we are so keen to make excuses for Warburton. The bottom line is he's preceded over our biggest collapse from a promising position in decades and the way he's done it is by making exactly the same mistakes that he has been making all through his tenure and at other clubs before that. I have no issues with anyone saying that this season's return is fine by them and the are happy to stick with this manager and have the same frustrations next season. Anyone who genuinely wants progress must surely see that this guy has run his course? Have a quick look at the 3 previous full time managers and you might appreciate MW a little more. |
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Post by Shania on Apr 17, 2022 11:42:25 GMT
His lack of tactical awareness still needs to be discussed by the Board imo. However, according to West London Sport it is already decided that he will be replaced at the end of the season. but that article could just be spin though. On the whole, I agree with the poster above. No doubt he has done a good job, but his general stubborness too often than not tends to backfire.
Not sure who I want to bring in, but Bilic is without a job and so is Dyche. Manning of Mk Don would probably be my choice. Kjetil Knudsen from Bodø Glimt is also a coach that I would like us to approch.
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Post by Shania on Apr 17, 2022 11:48:09 GMT
This argument around position in the league vs money spent is all well and good until you look at the table and see Luton and Huddersfield in play off contention. I don't know why we are so keen to make excuses for Warburton. The bottom line is he's preceded over our biggest collapse from a promising position in decades and the way he's done it is by making exactly the same mistakes that he has been making all through his tenure and at other clubs before that. I have no issues with anyone saying that this season's return is fine by them and the are happy to stick with this manager and have the same frustrations next season. Anyone who genuinely wants progress must surely see that this guy has run his course? On this particular day I chose to say Amen to this. |
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Post by sparks on Apr 17, 2022 11:49:15 GMT
Saw an article today that Dyche was earning £100k per week ! !!!
I know Norway is a very expensive place to live Shania but what would you estimate Kjetil Knudsen salary is at .
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Post by sparks on Apr 17, 2022 11:54:21 GMT
Unless MW is a very good Poker player I would guess by his body language he will get another year.
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Post by hal9thou on Apr 17, 2022 11:57:04 GMT
This argument around position in the league vs money spent is all well and good until you look at the table and see Luton and Huddersfield in play off contention. I don't know why we are so keen to make excuses for Warburton. The bottom line is he's preceded over our biggest collapse from a promising position in decades and the way he's done it is by making exactly the same mistakes that he has been making all through his tenure and at other clubs before that. I have no issues with anyone saying that this season's return is fine by them and the are happy to stick with this manager and have the same frustrations next season. Anyone who genuinely wants progress must surely see that this guy has run his course? Have a quick look at the 3 previous full time managers and you might appreciate MW a little more. which only highlights how shockingly poor the board are at making appointments. |
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Post by Shania on Apr 17, 2022 12:06:17 GMT
Saw an article today that Dyche was earning £100k per week ! !!! I know Norway is a very expensive place to live Shania but what would you estimate Kjetil Knudsen salary is at . Peanuts compared with Dyche. £15-20K per week perhaps. |
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Post by Tarbie on Apr 17, 2022 16:56:56 GMT
This argument around position in the league vs money spent is all well and good until you look at the table and see Luton and Huddersfield in play off contention. I don't know why we are so keen to make excuses for Warburton. The bottom line is he's preceded over our biggest collapse from a promising position in decades and the way he's done it is by making exactly the same mistakes that he has been making all through his tenure and at other clubs before that. I have no issues with anyone saying that this season's return is fine by them and the are happy to stick with this manager and have the same frustrations next season. Anyone who genuinely wants progress must surely see that this guy has run his course? Have a quick look at the 3 previous full time managers and you might appreciate MW a little more. So I'm meant to turn a blind eye to obvious short comings because he's slightly less shit that 3 Managers that came before him? |
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Post by stainrodisalegend on Apr 17, 2022 18:09:23 GMT
Have a quick look at the 3 previous full time managers and you might appreciate MW a little more. So I'm meant to turn a blind eye to obvious short comings because he's slightly less shit that 3 Managers that came before him? No but it is a suggestion that you be careful what you wish for - no guarantee a replacement is going to be as good, let alone better |
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Post by sparks on Apr 17, 2022 18:29:39 GMT
Is that because you have little faith in the owners/LF finding a good replacement Stainrod ?
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Post by Stanley75 on Apr 17, 2022 18:59:31 GMT
Interesting to note how split the forum is on whether the club should stick with MW or not.
Can't recall such divided opinion over a manager before.
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Post by West Acton on Apr 17, 2022 18:59:39 GMT
Plenty wanted him when Warburton got job. Still an option or soiled goods?
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Post by gtleighsr3 on Apr 17, 2022 19:14:40 GMT
Plenty wanted him when Warburton got job. Still an option or soiled goods? We never get mcds sponsor with him in the job |
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Post by Tarbie on Apr 17, 2022 19:17:01 GMT
I'd have had Bowyer back then Westy. His career hasn't gone great since, has it?
That Birmingham job is a poisoned chalice. Even worse record than us for derailing Managers' careers since the Chinese owners came in!
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Post by Ginger Ninja on Apr 17, 2022 19:27:13 GMT
Bowyer would do no better than Warbs has.
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Post by gtleighsr3 on Apr 17, 2022 20:50:42 GMT
I'd have had Bowyer back then Westy. His career hasn't gone great since, has it? That Birmingham job is a poisoned chalice. Even worse record than us for derailing Managers' careers since the Chinese owners came in! Gypsy curse |
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Post by stainrodisalegend on Apr 18, 2022 16:12:33 GMT
Is that because you have little faith in the owners/LF finding a good replacement Stainrod ? Partly that. With the exception of Warbs, have they got a single appointment right so far? And out of how many? But also because some researcher tabulated the results of every league club that has sacked their manager in recent years - typically the result is teams have a brief improvement but within 10 games are back to getting the same or very slightly worse results than they were before sacking the manager. In other words, sacking the manager is normally a knee-jerk, emotional response to bad results, not a strategy to get better results. I'm not saying Warbs shouldn't under any circumstances lose his job - tho I do think he has done a good job on the whole - but I am saying we should be damned sure we have someone better lined up first rather than sacking him because we are pissed off how this season has petered out. |
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Post by sparks on Apr 18, 2022 16:25:51 GMT
I was looking for an honest answer Stainrod and you gave one,fair play.
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Post by Timmy Doc on Apr 18, 2022 17:49:33 GMT
This argument around position in the league vs money spent is all well and good until you look at the table and see Luton and Huddersfield in play off contention. I don't know why we are so keen to make excuses for Warburton. The bottom line is he's preceded over our biggest collapse from a promising position in decades and the way he's done it is by making exactly the same mistakes that he has been making all through his tenure and at other clubs before that. I have no issues with anyone saying that this season's return is fine by them and the are happy to stick with this manager and have the same frustrations next season. Anyone who genuinely wants progress must surely see that this guy has run his course? Have a quick look at the 3 previous full time managers and you might appreciate MW a little more. We are a mid-table club in the Championship. If Warbs keeps us there then he has earned his place. He's arguably the only manager after Warnock who has improved us. For many seasons before him we were fighting against relegation. Also have a look what some alternative managers have done? Lee Bowyer, Nigel Pearson who I think was the most popular choice before Warbs. Don't want a managerial change just because we don't make play-offs. That would be stupid short term thinking imo. |
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Post by hubble on Apr 20, 2022 9:00:08 GMT
Have a quick look at the 3 previous full time managers and you might appreciate MW a little more. We are a mid-table club in the Championship. If Warbs keeps us there then he has earned his place. He's arguably the only manager after Warnock who has improved us. For many seasons before him we were fighting against relegation. Also have a look what some alternative managers have done? Lee Bowyer, Nigel Pearson who I think was the most popular choice before Warbs. Don't want a managerial change just because we don't make play-offs. That would be stupid short term thinking imo.
Have to say I agree with this. With the financial situation as it is and the infrastructure still not sorted, we're in no position to go up anyway. I always thought after the FFP fine that it would take several years to right the ship and so it's proved. But next year the board should be thinking play-offs/promotion are possible and act accordingly. A decent injection of cash for transfers in the summer will see us in with a reasonable chance. And I think Warburton's earned one more season.
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Post by alanwycombe on Apr 20, 2022 9:16:58 GMT
We are a mid-table club in the Championship. If Warbs keeps us there then he has earned his place. He's arguably the only manager after Warnock who has improved us. For many seasons before him we were fighting against relegation. Also have a look what some alternative managers have done? Lee Bowyer, Nigel Pearson who I think was the most popular choice before Warbs. Don't want a managerial change just because we don't make play-offs. That would be stupid short term thinking imo.
Have to say I agree with this. With the financial situation as it is and the infrastructure still not sorted, we're in no position to go up anyway. I always thought after the FFP fine that it would take several years to right the ship and so it's proved. But next year the board should be thinking play-offs/promotion are possible and act accordingly. A decent injection of cash for transfers in the summer will see us in with a reasonable chance. And I think Warburton's earned one more season.
Hubs, the (financial) position we’re in is precisely why we needed to go up. It doesn’t matter about being good enough for Prem, it’s about getting there. Where’s the decent injection of cash coming from? We’re losing money weekly. The time to inject cash, if that’s even possible as we stand, was January - then we had a great chance of the Prem bonanza - then we could start looking at putting the club on a sound footing. |
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Post by Stanley75 on Apr 20, 2022 9:28:15 GMT
we're in no position to go up Last time I checked the rule book, if you get promoted, either automatically or via the play-offs, then by definition you are in the position to go up. |
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Post by hubble on Apr 20, 2022 9:39:59 GMT
we're in no position to go up Last time I checked the rule book, if you get promoted, either automatically or via the play-offs, then by definition you are in the position to go up.
Stan, you're quibbling over semantics, but I'm sure you know what I mean. However, to make it clear: what I mean is that with the poor squad we have and the lack of a proper academy, we would be the whipping boys of the Premier league. The teams that go up who are in good shape - i.e. ready for the prem as they can be - tend to stay there, at least for more than one season. And we all know what splashing tons of cash in an attempt to adjust leads to.
And Alan, yes, you're right, one assured way of getting plenty of cash is to get promoted. But we also have a board flush with money, should they choose to spend it. And for the reasons I've cited above, I'd rather we went up with a good squad and infrastructure than everything a mess.
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Post by Corbray on Apr 20, 2022 9:41:27 GMT
one of the most infuriating things about this season is that we're likely going to have to sell a few players and bring in unknowns to replace them.
i reckon barbet will stick around but dickie and chair will probably be sold. plus wallace and adomah will likely be released too which was a given.
as for managers, neil critchley would be absolutely top of my list to replace warbs.
don't think we'll get dyche but he would be an excellent acquasition. knutsen's stock is far too high for us and i can see him going to ajax personally.
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Post by Stanley75 on Apr 20, 2022 9:50:12 GMT
The (financial) position we’re in is precisely why we needed to go up. It doesn’t matter about being good enough for Prem, it’s about getting there. Where’s the decent injection of cash coming from? We’re losing money weekly. The time to inject cash, if that’s even possible as we stand, was January - then we had a great chance of the Prem bonanza - then we could start looking at putting the club on a sound footing. Exactly Alan. With us it's always "we're not ready yet". Well wake up, you're never ready until it actually happens and then you just deal with it. Look what happened the last time couple of times we got promoted. We weren't "ready" then either. Then we got relegated, but we took all those millions in parachute money, right? And that sure helped us out. It's always "next season or the season after", never this season. Next season, schmext season. We always say it but it's pie in the sky. "Oh but we must build for the future! We are still building!" I hear them cry. When will the penny drop? Being a yoyo club is HOW you build. It's a proven successful business model. The horse goes before the cart. |
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Post by spongeparr on Apr 20, 2022 10:06:06 GMT
one of the most infuriating things about this season is that we're likely going to have to sell a few players and bring in unknowns to replace them.
i reckon barbet will stick around but dickie and chair will probably be sold. plus wallace and adomah will likely be released too which was a given. as for managers, neil critchley would be absolutely top of my list to replace warbs. don't think we'll get dyche but he would be an excellent acquasition. knutsen's stock is far too high for us and i can see him going to ajax personally. Why is that a bad thing? If recruitment is good, then doesn't matter if we haven't heard of them. Going for names isn't the best way to do things, in my view. Brentford for example. No one had heard of their players yet look at them now. Even if you go to Liverpool, you have Jota and Diaz who have come in from smaller teams and been brilliant, due to good recruiting. |
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Post by alanwycombe on Apr 20, 2022 10:19:57 GMT
Last time I checked the rule book, if you get promoted, either automatically or via the play-offs, then by definition you are in the position to go up.
Stan, you're quibbling over semantics, but I'm sure you know what I mean. However, to make it clear: what I mean is that with the poor squad we have and the lack of a proper academy, we would be the whipping boys of the Premier league. The teams that go up who are in good shape - i.e. ready for the prem as they can be - tend to stay there, at least for more than one season. And we all know what splashing tons of cash in an attempt to adjust leads to.
And Alan, yes, you're right, one assured way of getting plenty of cash is to get promoted. But we also have a board flush with money, should they choose to spend it. And for the reasons I've cited above, I'd rather we went up with a good squad and infrastructure than everything a mess.
They might be flush with money but the idea is the club should eventually stand on its own feet not keep seeing bale outs and share conversions from the owners. They walk away and we’re finished. |
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Post by spongeparr on Apr 20, 2022 10:26:14 GMT
Stan, you're quibbling over semantics, but I'm sure you know what I mean. However, to make it clear: what I mean is that with the poor squad we have and the lack of a proper academy, we would be the whipping boys of the Premier league. The teams that go up who are in good shape - i.e. ready for the prem as they can be - tend to stay there, at least for more than one season. And we all know what splashing tons of cash in an attempt to adjust leads to.
And Alan, yes, you're right, one assured way of getting plenty of cash is to get promoted. But we also have a board flush with money, should they choose to spend it. And for the reasons I've cited above, I'd rather we went up with a good squad and infrastructure than everything a mess.
They might be flush with money but the idea is the club should eventually stand on its own feet not keep seeing bale outs and share conversions from the owners. They walk away and we’re finished. Look how many billionaires that wanted to buy Chelsea. There will be plenty more that would want to buy us and get us into the top league. |
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Post by alanwycombe on Apr 20, 2022 10:26:52 GMT
Bottom line still remains that we were looking at a big pay day in our own hands and we blew it. We might not have made it but it was before injuries mounted up so that’s no excuse.
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