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Post by esoxlucius on Feb 4, 2020 9:15:55 GMT
It's a real shame that Lumley hasn't made a howler for a while. What's your point with that comment Esox? Comes across like you're just trying to stir the pot to be honest! and you don't think the OP is just shit stirring? I have serious misgivings about why work at Warren Farm hasn't begun yet but why have a go at Les & the academy just because we haven't had all our stars since they could toddle? It seems like some can't survive their own lives without having a pop at someone/ anyone. It's not stifling debate as there are things that do need questioning but, after six or seven years of the absolute clusterfuck we endured, the last three years of pointing in the right direction should be receiving a lot more credit that questioning why we are paying the people behind it. There is so much negativity about QPR as it is by so called QPR fans that makes me start to question why they think they are QPR fans. All the bollocks about "we used to ..." is just bollocks; we have what we have now to support and right now, that is what is needed support. When, and if, the need arises, as it did during the Fulham Park Rangers debacle, I WILL be protesting along the other loyal supporters who don't want the club to go under but I don't see any productive mileage in slagging off people who have been behind the turnaround, especially on the basis of some dubious ITK claim. We are seeing players being driven out of the club because of fan abuse and the way things are going, Josh won't be the last. Would you be proud of being one of those people? Snide remarks, outright abuse, all becoming part of the QPR "fair criticism" toolkit these day and it fucking stinks. Obviously this doesn't apply to all posters and tweeters but it is still disgraceful that QPR fans think abusing and taking the piss out of the club counts as support.
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Post by esoxlucius on Feb 4, 2020 9:25:12 GMT
It's a real shame that Lumley hasn't made a howler for a while. Keep burying your head in the sand. If you’ve got nothing constructive to add.... Keep slagging off the staff at the club you claim to support. Les' restructuring of the academy, and the staff he has employed to assist in this happens to be one of the real highlights of the last few years despite not all of the players having been at the club since they could walk. What did you hope to achieve by casting a shadow on it with some spurious ITK claim in your OP? Make the other posters hate QPR ? Maker them hate Les and Chris? What DID you hope to achieve. If you have genuine issues about something that is/ has happened then spill; at least then we could agree with you that something needs doing but a snidey "do you think we should be paying Les this much?" is a cunt's trick. Are you one of those that think we should get rid of the board in toto and hope the next lot in will be better? They might well be as it would be harder to fuck it up more than Fernandes did in his first seven or eight seasons but that isn't the case now is it? Would you want to invest in a football team with fans as toxic as ours? A group of people getting ready to jump on any decision they don't like? A group of people who think it is perfectly acceptable to abuse and libel all over social media? Thank fuck all our fans aren't of the same mind as you.
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Post by alanwycombe on Feb 4, 2020 9:44:24 GMT
Jesus... Why do you bother with this board Esox? I for one am interested in all posts and posters - I don't have to agree and I don't need someone constantly trying to take the moral high ground and putting people in their place. Here's a tip, your War and Peace diatribes will only put people off. Make your point briefly and accept others have different views. My best mate on here rarely agrees with me and I don't give a shit.
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Post by esoxlucius on Feb 4, 2020 9:47:55 GMT
Jesus... Why do you bother with this board Esox? I for one am interested in all posts and posters - I don't have to agree and I don't need someone constantly trying to take the moral high ground and putting people in their place. Here's a tip, your War and Peace diatribes will only put people off. Make your point briefly and accept others have different views. My best mate on here rarely agrees with me and I don't give a shit. Point. Support the club.
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Post by alanwycombe on Feb 4, 2020 9:51:31 GMT
They all do. Can still comment. Others don't have to accept but constantly defending EVERYTHING is ridiculous.
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Post by esoxlucius on Feb 4, 2020 9:58:40 GMT
They all do. Can still comment. Others don't have to accept but constantly defending EVERYTHING is ridiculous. I don't constantly defend everything, I already said I am not happy about Warren Farm not going ahead and certainly unhappy that the board want to fund it with a bond but no-one seems to want to talk about that, they would rather slag off the players and the staff. I am almost certain that two of our board members having been made to relinquish their executive positions within the Air Asia group should be of more concern than Grant Hall was out of position when Bristol scored but Hall is an easier target for our fans.
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Post by jfrabbit on Feb 4, 2020 10:01:59 GMT
Haha esox Superfan you’re embarrassing mate.
Do you know how football forums work? It’s a question that was asked due to our financial predicament. Are we getting enough out of certain people / areas within the club and are they warranted.
Is that really such an awful question? I think not. If you’re that precious sweetheart it’s probably best you don’t come onto forums like this as questions will be asked.
I’ve been to 100’s of games over 40+ years the length and breadth of this country supporting Queens Park Rangers. If I want to debate certain issues at the club then unfortunately for you I will.
For me we are not producing anywhere near enough for a London club with regards to youth. I also don’t personally believe we need a position that Les Holds at this present time.
Let’s not forget this is the legend of the club that chose Reading (READING FFS) over QPR when we needed him in his last swan song as a player.
I care about QPR not Les Ferdinand or anyone else staff wise. Sorry to inform you of that.
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Post by esoxlucius on Feb 4, 2020 10:19:06 GMT
Haha esox Superfan you’re embarrassing mate. Do you know how football forums work? It’s a question that was asked due to our financial predicament. Are we getting enough out of certain people / areas within the club and are they warranted. Is that really such an awful question? I think not. If you’re that precious sweetheart it’s probably best you don’t come onto forums like this as questions will be asked. I’ve been to 100’s of games over 40+ years the length and breadth of this country supporting Queens Park Rangers. If I want to debate certain issues at the club then unfortunately for you I will. For me we are not producing anywhere near enough for a London club with regards to youth. I also don’t personally believe we need a position that Les Holds at this present time. Let’s not forget this is the legend of the club that chose Reading (READING FFS) over QPR when we needed him in his last swan song as a player. I care about QPR not Les Ferdinand or anyone else staff wise. Sorry to inform you of that. If it's a dick swinging contest; I have been going home and away for over 50 years and been to all but a handful of the grounds in the leagues. Patronising me with terms like sweetheart doesn't reflect well on you either. All you have done is raise doubts about the club based on your OPINION not fact. I was talking to a Portsmouth scout after the Charlton game and his view is that QPR have one of the most admired academies around, which was why he had been watching our U16, U18 & U23 games in recent months. Our academy before Les restructured it was a useless money pit that produced Raheem Sterling and Josh Bowler who left because he felt QPR were holding him back. Les is worth every penny he is getting in my OPINION just for having coaches who have brought the best out of other clubs rejects. If you don't like being called out on forums then I suggest you don't post on them, it's what they are there for isn't it?
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Post by jfrabbit on Feb 4, 2020 10:24:06 GMT
Haha esox Superfan you’re embarrassing mate. Do you know how football forums work? It’s a question that was asked due to our financial predicament. Are we getting enough out of certain people / areas within the club and are they warranted. Is that really such an awful question? I think not. If you’re that precious sweetheart it’s probably best you don’t come onto forums like this as questions will be asked. I’ve been to 100’s of games over 40+ years the length and breadth of this country supporting Queens Park Rangers. If I want to debate certain issues at the club then unfortunately for you I will. For me we are not producing anywhere near enough for a London club with regards to youth. I also don’t personally believe we need a position that Les Holds at this present time. Let’s not forget this is the legend of the club that chose Reading (READING FFS) over QPR when we needed him in his last swan song as a player. I care about QPR not Les Ferdinand or anyone else staff wise. Sorry to inform you of that. If it's a dick swinging contest; I have been going home and away for over 50 years and been to all but a handful of the grounds in the leagues. Patronising me with terms like sweetheart doesn't reflect well on you either. All you have done is raise doubts about the club based on your OPINION not fact. I was talking to a Portsmouth scout after the Charlton game and his view is that QPR have one of the most admired academies around, which was why he had been watching our U16, U18 & U23 games in recent months. Our academy before Les restructured it was a useless money pit that produced Raheem Sterling and Josh Bowler who left because he felt QPR were holding him back. Les is worth every penny he is getting in my OPINION just for having coaches who have brought the best out of other clubs rejects. If you don't like being called out on forums then I suggest you don't post on them, it's what they are there for isn't it? Called out haha. You’re pathetic mate. Because you’re a Les fan boy I can see your view. Unfortunately I’m not a fan boy of anyone so can see things a lot clearer. I’ll also say I know a lot of things that I can’t put on this forum that I’m sure would change your opinion of your legend but we’ll leave that for another day. Not my place. Great you spoke to someone from Portsmouth, how nice. I happen to speak to numerous people at the club on a daily basis who have told me the lack of young talent at the club is ‘alarming’ and our youth set up and standard of players is poor. Anyway you live in your bubble princess. I’m a realist not a fantasist.
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Post by gtleighsr3 on Feb 4, 2020 10:25:22 GMT
I have less rows at home and I've been married 26 years😊
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Post by jfrabbit on Feb 4, 2020 10:26:34 GMT
I have less rows at home and I've been married 26 years😊 Congrats pat yourself on the back.
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Post by gtleighsr3 on Feb 4, 2020 10:30:09 GMT
I cant ,her thumb is on it.
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Post by jfrabbit on Feb 4, 2020 10:30:28 GMT
I cant ,her thumb is on it. 😂😂👍🏼👍🏼
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Post by alanwycombe on Feb 4, 2020 10:32:08 GMT
To get back to the point, I've never been a fan of, nor understood, the role of DOF at a club like ours but I'm not going to knock Ramsey as I don't know enough about exactly what he does - but I do know his appearance at Villa one evening and on the bench a couple of times has made a positive difference. To the names already mentioned you can add Bettache who, I believe, was at Watford, and Smyth who we brought over from Ireland. My worry is that we are supposed to have this great youth set up but no one truly home grown is knocking on the door. Developing players is one thing but if we are not attractive in the first place it needs addressing.
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Post by esoxlucius on Feb 4, 2020 10:33:10 GMT
If it's a dick swinging contest; I have been going home and away for over 50 years and been to all but a handful of the grounds in the leagues. Patronising me with terms like sweetheart doesn't reflect well on you either. All you have done is raise doubts about the club based on your OPINION not fact. I was talking to a Portsmouth scout after the Charlton game and his view is that QPR have one of the most admired academies around, which was why he had been watching our U16, U18 & U23 games in recent months. Our academy before Les restructured it was a useless money pit that produced Raheem Sterling and Josh Bowler who left because he felt QPR were holding him back. Les is worth every penny he is getting in my OPINION just for having coaches who have brought the best out of other clubs rejects. If you don't like being called out on forums then I suggest you don't post on them, it's what they are there for isn't it? Called out haha. You’re pathetic mate. Because you’re a Les fan boy I can see your view. Unfortunately I’m not a fan boy of anyone so can see things a lot clearer. I’ll also say I know a lot of things that I can’t put on this forum that I’m sure would change your opinion of your legend but we’ll leave that for another day. Not my place. Great you spoke to someone from Portsmouth, how nice. I happen to speak to numerous people at the club on a daily basis who have told me the lack of young talent at the club is ‘alarming’ and our youth set up and standard of players is poor. Anyway you live in your bubble princess. I’m a realist not a fantasist. I call bullshit on that. I speak with the academy players quite a bit, and will provide names if requested, and they all have nothing but praise for the academy and the coaching. You sound like like that whinging bitch Pete McCullagh who lives to slag off Les and the academy because it was better when he was coaching there with his mates Joe & Steve.
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Post by jfrabbit on Feb 4, 2020 10:34:25 GMT
To get back to the point, I've never been a fan of, nor understood, the role of DOF at a club like ours but I'm not going to knock Ramsey as I don't know enough about exactly what he does - but I do know his appearance at Villa one evening and on the bench a couple of times has made a positive difference. To the names already mentioned you can add Bettache who, I believe, was at Watford, and Smyth who we brought over from Ireland. My worry is that we are supposed to have this great youth set up but no one truly home grown is knocking on the door. Developing players is one thing but if we are not attractive in the first place it needs addressing. Good points Al and I’ve openly backed CR when others were hammering him. Just not convinced enough being done to push on with regards to taking youngsters through to the first team which is vital to us. He’s a top top coach no doubts about that.
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Post by jfrabbit on Feb 4, 2020 10:37:35 GMT
Called out haha. You’re pathetic mate. Because you’re a Les fan boy I can see your view. Unfortunately I’m not a fan boy of anyone so can see things a lot clearer. I’ll also say I know a lot of things that I can’t put on this forum that I’m sure would change your opinion of your legend but we’ll leave that for another day. Not my place. Great you spoke to someone from Portsmouth, how nice. I happen to speak to numerous people at the club on a daily basis who have told me the lack of young talent at the club is ‘alarming’ and our youth set up and standard of players is poor. Anyway you live in your bubble princess. I’m a realist not a fantasist. I call bullshit on that. I speak with the academy players quite a bit, and will provide names if requested, and they all have nothing but praise for the academy and the coaching. You sound like like that whinging bitch Pete McCullagh who lives to slag off Les and the academy because it was better when he was coaching there with his mates Joe & Steve. Yea go for it name your names? ? You speak to academy players haha. Yea they’re gonna know what’s going on at high levels of the club aren’t they?! 🤣🤦🏻♂️ If you spend a bit of time looking through my 1000’s of posts combined on here or WATRB I will agree with every word you said if you can dig out where I’ve ever slagged off or slated LF Please go for it. It was a question not an agenda. Like I said I’m really not that bothered just interested to hear views. As mentioned it’s a football forum. It’s kind of how things work on one.
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Post by esoxlucius on Feb 4, 2020 10:51:20 GMT
To get back to the point, I've never been a fan of, nor understood, the role of DOF at a club like ours but I'm not going to knock Ramsey as I don't know enough about exactly what he does - but I do know his appearance at Villa one evening and on the bench a couple of times has made a positive difference. To the names already mentioned you can add Bettache who, I believe, was at Watford, and Smyth who we brought over from Ireland. My worry is that we are supposed to have this great youth set up but no one truly home grown is knocking on the door. Developing players is one thing but if we are not attractive in the first place it needs addressing. Good points Al and I’ve openly backed CR when others were hammering him. Just not convinced enough being done to push on with regards to taking youngsters through to the first team which is vital to us. He’s a top top coach no doubts about that. OK, all arguing in other posts aside, a fresh start. Where are the club getting it wrong with getting the youngsters being pushed towards first team football? Since the restructure Paul Hall has been quite clear that the results weren't as important as getting the players ready to go on and get themselves professional contracts. A lot of this years U23's are being taken from the U18's which a couple of were only just promoted from the U16's into; Jake Frailing & Joe Gubbins spring to mind. Even Nathan Carlyle who was rejected by Millwall has had a sniff of first team action. We have Faisal Bettache, Amrit Bansal-McNulty, Ody Alfa, Ben Wells, Themis Kefalas and others that don't spring to mind atm who have been sent out on loan to learn to play in the men's game. I'm sure too that we will be seeing a lot more of Dillon DeSilva and Arke Jude-Boyd in the next couple of seasons too, barring injury (Charley Kendall springs to mind). We had a young centreback from Spurs playing for us during the week which may mean we are picking up another cast off soon with resale value. This would appear to be the current policy until we ever get a proper training ground of our own as I suspect the teams below the U16's may be suffering due to lack of facilities (apologies for calling bullshit on your claim if it was indeed these teams you were referring to earlier). Once WF is up and running I would hope that the cascade effect would stretch down further than the U16's and we will see a huge leap forward in the advancement of kids who join us at 8 onwards.
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Post by jfrabbit on Feb 4, 2020 11:06:12 GMT
It’s ok saying where are we going wrong with regards to youngsters being pushed towards first team football but that’s what every club in the world would do. What concerns me is the obvious lack of talent actually coming through.
As mentioned above who can provide a list of players that have made the first team or made the first team and become a regular?
I can’t think of any and something is seriously wrong with that.
I don’t know if it’s our recruitment, coaching, facilities, management or whatever but all I know is something is not right if a London club can not produce one decent youngster a season.
All the names you mentioned are probably decent young hard working lads. I’ve no doubt about that. Will any of them ever make the first team and stay there? That’s the important question otherwise what’s the point?
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Post by esoxlucius on Feb 4, 2020 11:23:06 GMT
It’s ok saying where are we going wrong with regards to youngsters being pushed towards first team football but that’s what every club in the world would do. What concerns me is the obvious lack of talent actually coming through. As mentioned above who can provide a list of players that have made the first team or made the first team and become a regular? I can’t think of any and something is seriously wrong with that. I don’t know if it’s our recruitment, coaching, facilities, management or whatever but all I know is something is not right if a London club can not produce one decent youngster a season. All the names you mentioned are probably decent young hard working lads. I’ve no doubt about that. Will any of them ever make the first team and stay there? That’s the important question otherwise what’s the point? Well the only two in recent years that we have had in our academy for a long time are Joe Lumley (since he was 12) and Darnell Furlong who was deemed good enough to attract the attention of a side which will possibly be plying their trade in the EPL next season. Bansal-McNulty will almost certainly be Eze's replacement when Ebere leaves. Jake Frailing has something of an Ale Faurlin about him and, bar injury I expect to see him hold down a place in a first team. As I said previously, because of the two training grounds we rent, there is a disconnect between the U16's and above to the U14's and below. I won't pretend that I have seen it but I have been told that not only Paul Hall but Les & MW go along to watch the U14's etc. fairly regularly to try to make sure there is continuity. At the moment, all we can do is pick up other teams rejects and polish them to a finish the way we have with Chair, Eze, Oteh, Smyth, BOS etc. (I grant you BOS was Blackpool's young player of the year but you can definitely see an improvement over the player we bought) I think Mide Shodipo will end up a first team player somewhere else as he just doesn't seem to have made his mark the way we thought he would. Dalling is a strange one as all his U23's team mates from a few seasons ago have gone on to make it but he is still providing the steady influence in the U23's up until his cameo recently. To see what you are asking for will take the time elapsed from an U8 joining us two years ago (U10's now) until they hit the U18's, U23's so we are looking at maybe ten years before you can judge the academy on that issue. If we don't get WF built then I feel we will have to rely on what we are currently doing in picking up rejects as a lot of parents will be heavily influenced by clubs that have training grounds with all the bells and whistles even if they end up being tossed on the heap before their 18th birthday.
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Post by jfrabbit on Feb 4, 2020 11:27:54 GMT
Thanks for the reply and in all honesty it doesn’t fill me with great hope.
Picking up other clubs rejects and moulding them into better players for our benefit seems the way forward for us if I’m honest as it’s working.
Reading your post, it all points to the importance of WF and the benefits that will bring. Until then I think it’s going to be much of the same for quite a long time.
While we’re on the subject where are we even at with WF? I’ve lost track due to constant interruptions on the legal side of it.
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Post by esoxlucius on Feb 4, 2020 11:45:27 GMT
Thanks for the reply and in all honesty it doesn’t fill me with great hope. Picking up other clubs rejects and moulding them into better players for our benefit seems the way forward for us if I’m honest as it’s working. Reading your post, it all points to the importance of WF and the benefits that will bring. Until then I think it’s going to be much of the same for quite a long time. While we’re on the subject where are we even at with WF? I’ve lost track due to constant interruptions on the legal side of it. To the best of my knowledge (all second hand) The Save Warren farm group no longer exists since they exhausted every possible legal avenue to stop QPR. There is now a new group being crowd funded for a legal battle that is based on the premise that since the ground has been unattended so long that it should no longer be classified as a sports ground but as a meadow and enjoy rural protection (you couldn't make this shit up could you?) There were rumours that the Sultan of Brunei was in the background of the last group along with a Brentford supporting legal brief /QC but I can't confirm that. I would also suspect that since OOC and HS2 has petered out a significant amount, a lack of interest by the Tune Group to spend money on WF could be a possibility, especially since the announcement that they wanted to fund it with a bond issue. I understand the calls for a new board but mine would be more from this standpoint, rather than any regarding the playing side reservations. The way things stand our only hope would be the Mittals taking back a controlling interest from Ruben Gnangalingam and funding these much needed improvements. I feel the playing side will never show much sign of improvement due to the P&S facet of FFP until we move into a multi purpose stadium which can generate more than £8m a season on football matches.
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Post by croydoncaptainjack on Feb 4, 2020 12:07:20 GMT
I wouldn't pay Les 16k a year to run the fucking corner shop. Hoos is just the rubber stamper for the board, nice earner though. Never forget Uncles airline dosh was massively state subsidised. The idea that he's some kind of financial guru is laughable. Bernie (for one) pissed all over him. Yes, let's have Bernie back. Happy days.
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Post by Ginger Ninja on Feb 4, 2020 12:46:15 GMT
I wouldn't pay Les 16k a year to run the fucking corner shop. Hoos is just the rubber stamper for the board, nice earner though. Never forget Uncles airline dosh was massively state subsidised. The idea that he's some kind of financial guru is laughable. Bernie (for one) pissed all over him. Yes, let's have Bernie back. Happy days. Begs fucking belief that anyone would want that walking corpse back in charge.
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Post by hal9thou on Feb 4, 2020 13:29:39 GMT
Yes, let's have Bernie back. Happy days. Begs fucking belief that anyone would want that walking corpse back in charge.
Did anyone suggest that? Read the thread.
The original Bernie reference was to Uncle's F1 confessions. We're talking about the financial background here, not who might or might not become involved in the event of a Tune exit.
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Post by gtleighsr3 on Feb 4, 2020 13:54:17 GMT
Walking corpse,your a genius,I've never seen a story film or series about such things. I'm getting in touch with a agent.
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Post by Corbray on Feb 4, 2020 13:57:39 GMT
To get back to the point, I've never been a fan of, nor understood, the role of DOF at a club like ours but I'm not going to knock Ramsey as I don't know enough about exactly what he does - but I do know his appearance at Villa one evening and on the bench a couple of times has made a positive difference. To the names already mentioned you can add Bettache who, I believe, was at Watford, and Smyth who we brought over from Ireland. My worry is that we are supposed to have this great youth set up but no one truly home grown is knocking on the door. Developing players is one thing but if we are not attractive in the first place it needs addressing. Good points Al and I’ve openly backed CR when others were hammering him. Just not convinced enough being done to push on with regards to taking youngsters through to the first team which is vital to us. He’s a top top coach no doubts about that. bringing through our own players takes time though, and a long time at that. CR has been in his role since what ... 2016? we've already seen his hand in play with the likes of eze, chair, furlong and lumley etc and have picked up other youngsters along the way. bringing through kids though is time intensive and to get the most talented kids here we need to convince their parents that QPR is the best place to develop them over other london clubs. what we're doing right now in picking up diamonds in the rough and polishing them up is a good start to show parents that developing players is what we strive to do. without coming across as biased, if i had a child who was a talented footballer and i had the choice between chelsea or qpr i'd honestly choose qpr over chelsea. chelsea produce players yes but they get lost in the shuffle and i imagine that they let go dozens of kids every year. at qpr we're paying close attention to our youngsters and setting them up to progress into the first team eventually
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Post by gtleighsr3 on Feb 4, 2020 14:03:44 GMT
My son had choice of spurs ,orient col Utd and Southend,chose southend
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Post by croydoncaptainjack on Feb 4, 2020 14:47:01 GMT
Begs fucking belief that anyone would want that walking corpse back in charge.
Did anyone suggest that? Read the thread.
The original Bernie reference was to Uncle's F1 confessions. We're talking about the financial background here, not who might or might not become involved in the event of a Tune exit.
Apologies, if I misunderstood mate. There is no question Bernie became fabulously wealthy due to F1.
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Post by gtleighsr3 on Feb 4, 2020 14:53:17 GMT
I never get the fascination with how much people earn,its their business,and if it lots for fuck all,goid luck to them.wish I was them.
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