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Post by alanwycombe on Feb 4, 2020 14:54:29 GMT
I never get the fascination with how much people earn,its their business,and if it lots for fuck all,goid luck to them.wish I was them. Totally agree. I think the comment was made in the context that we're skint.
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Post by gtleighsr3 on Feb 4, 2020 15:05:45 GMT
But as a club we not skint,bills are paid etc,we cant spend lots ok but can spend. Skit is like Bolton.
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Post by Ginger Ninja on Feb 4, 2020 15:17:34 GMT
Begs fucking belief that anyone would want that walking corpse back in charge.
Did anyone suggest that? Read the thread.
The original Bernie reference was to Uncle's F1 confessions. We're talking about the financial background here, not who might or might not become involved in the event of a Tune exit.
Nobody here suggested that, so I'm not sure why your knickers are in a twist. I've seen it elsewhere, people asking why we haven't got Briatore and Bernie back.
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hal9thou
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Post by hal9thou on Feb 4, 2020 16:00:16 GMT
Did anyone suggest that? Read the thread.
The original Bernie reference was to Uncle's F1 confessions. We're talking about the financial background here, not who might or might not become involved in the event of a Tune exit.
Nobody here suggested that, so I'm not sure why your knickers are in a twist. They are awfully tight today, but was just pointing out that I mentioned the living corpse re F1 / Uncle shenanigans.
Bernie fucked pretty much the whole world year in year out so Uncle shouldn't feel too sore.... (see what I did there )
Flava Flav didn't do too badly for us though when you look at the stats....
#gunsinnaboardroom
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Post by Ginger Ninja on Feb 4, 2020 16:14:33 GMT
Nobody here suggested that, so I'm not sure why your knickers are in a twist. They are awfully tight today, but was just pointing out that I mentioned the living corpse re F1 / Uncle shenanigans.
Bernie fucked pretty much the whole world year in year out so Uncle shouldn't feel too sore.... (see what I did there )
Flava Flav didn't do too badly for us though when you look at the stats....
#gunsinnaboardroom
I'm not sure I agree with the last bit, we only really improved and ultimately went up after Amit and Ishan took the reins. Wasn't the guns in the boardroom thing to do with Paladini, pre-Flav? Apologies for the knickers comment, I'm on my sick bed and man flu takes a toll yaknow?
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Post by Bill on Feb 4, 2020 16:37:45 GMT
Keep burying your head in the sand. If you’ve got nothing constructive to add.... Keep slagging off the staff at the club you claim to support. Les' restructuring of the academy, and the staff he has employed to assist in this happens to be one of the real highlights of the last few years despite not all of the players having been at the club since they could walk. What did you hope to achieve by casting a shadow on it with some spurious ITK claim in your OP? Make the other posters hate QPR ? Maker them hate Les and Chris? What DID you hope to achieve. If you have genuine issues about something that is/ has happened then spill; at least then we could agree with you that something needs doing but a snidey "do you think we should be paying Les this much?" is a cunt's trick. Are you one of those that think we should get rid of the board in toto and hope the next lot in will be better? They might well be as it would be harder to fuck it up more than Fernandes did in his first seven or eight seasons but that isn't the case now is it? Would you want to invest in a football team with fans as toxic as ours? A group of people getting ready to jump on any decision they don't like? A group of people who think it is perfectly acceptable to abuse and libel all over social media? Thank fuck all our fans aren't of the same mind as you. 6ook for learning on the job incredible. GIS A JOB LF great player but DOF never our club does not need a dof. We are at present a relativly small fish in a big pond no more no less and in all honesty i cant see us getting back to the top for a minimum of 10 years. Not being pesimistic just realistic as we are in a black hole courtesy of the EFL and their inconsistances regarding finance.
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Post by esoxlucius on Feb 4, 2020 18:17:54 GMT
Our club obviously did need a D.of F. as it was his appointment, along with Lee Hoos, that started to get the club back to where it needed to be. I agree with the time frame you state as without a multi purpose stadium I can't see us ever getting ahead of the game unless we pull a rabbit out of the hat and sell a player for ridiculous money every season. Paying for two training grounds isn't helping matters financially even if the expense doesn't count against our P&S submission it still has to be paid for out of the club's money.
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Post by Bill on Feb 4, 2020 18:39:02 GMT
I say again 600 k for learning on the job no way. Have to agree to disagree,for the time he has been in the role i dont see much progress in real terms. A succession of poor managerial appts says it all for me.
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Post by esoxlucius on Feb 4, 2020 18:45:13 GMT
I say again 600 k for learning on the job no way. Have to agree to disagree,for the time he has been in the role i don't see much progress in real terms. A succession of poor managerial appts says it all for me. The academy? I believe that we have had eighteen academy players promoted into the first team over the last three seasons. We also have many more out on loan at league clubs than we have had in an age. The next step will be to get the training ground so that the teams at U14 and lower can train alongside the more senior sides. This won't count for much with most on here but the award winning work done in the community and the way the club dealt with the Grenfell disaster is something that Les has got spot on. He did take on the role fully qualified to do so which means it wasn't a old pals act appointment; it was his first job in that role.
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hal9thou
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Post by hal9thou on Feb 4, 2020 18:57:55 GMT
They are awfully tight today, but was just pointing out that I mentioned the living corpse re F1 / Uncle shenanigans.
Bernie fucked pretty much the whole world year in year out so Uncle shouldn't feel too sore.... (see what I did there )
Flava Flav didn't do too badly for us though when you look at the stats....
#gunsinnaboardroom
Apologies for the knickers comment, I'm on my sick bed and man flu takes a toll yaknow?
No need for apologies mate, get well.
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Post by Bill on Feb 4, 2020 19:24:40 GMT
I say again 600 k for learning on the job no way. Have to agree to disagree,for the time he has been in the role i don't see much progress in real terms. A succession of poor managerial appts says it all for me. The academy? I believe that we have had eighteen academy players promoted into the first team over the last three seasons. We also have many more out on loan at league clubs than we have had in an age. The next step will be to get the training ground so that the teams at U14 and lower can train alongside the more senior sides. This won't count for much with most on here but the award winning work done in the community and the way the club dealt with the Grenfell disaster is something that Les has got spot on. He did take on the role fully qualified to do so which means it wasn't a old pals act appointment; it was his first job in that role. Of course he took the job 600k and no experience who would,nt. Sorry does not cut it imo.
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Post by esoxlucius on Feb 4, 2020 19:50:53 GMT
The academy? I believe that we have had eighteen academy players promoted into the first team over the last three seasons. We also have many more out on loan at league clubs than we have had in an age. The next step will be to get the training ground so that the teams at U14 and lower can train alongside the more senior sides. This won't count for much with most on here but the award winning work done in the community and the way the club dealt with the Grenfell disaster is something that Les has got spot on. He did take on the role fully qualified to do so which means it wasn't a old pals act appointment; it was his first job in that role. Of course he took the job 600k and no experience who would,nt. Sorry does not cut it imo. What is he failing to do?
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Post by Tarbie on Feb 5, 2020 8:44:40 GMT
Esox, I'm gonna flip that question around. What is Les actually doing these days?
I fully understand why Les was necessary post Harry and Hughes. I totally appreciate the work that went into putting some structure in place at the club, and reducing expenditure etc.
I just don't see what value he brings right now. I mean seriously, what does Les actually do for the club in this given moment? And are you seriously telling me that a club of our size and our ambitions genuinely needs a CEO, Technical Director & Director of Football over and above an experienced Manager?
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Post by esoxlucius on Feb 5, 2020 9:23:55 GMT
Esox, I'm gonna flip that question around. What is Les actually doing these days? I fully understand why Les was necessary post Harry and Hughes. I totally appreciate the work that went into putting some structure in place at the club, and reducing expenditure etc. I just don't see what value he bring right now. I mean seriously, what does Les actually do for the club in this given moment? And are you seriously telling me that a club of our size and our ambitions genuinely needs a CEO, Technical Director & Director of Football over and above an experienced Manager? He is still in overall charge of the academy and attends sessions at the different age groups regularly and then, presumably feeds back to MW who will/ should be concentrating on the first team. He administers the whole QPR in the community set up which rather than explain what that is in detail, go take a look on Google. He sits on the board and thereby feeds back to the owners the state of play in the day to day business of the club. He will be liaising with Lee Hoos on the financial aspects of the club relating to the playing staff and teams. I guess as you are overseas you don't take a lot of interest other than the match day events but Les is there every day and on matchdays is always available to talk to fans and do the schmoozing bit too. He also isn't afraid to engage in conversations with the unhappy fans, like many on here, over his role and what he sees as the future for the club, a guy after the Bristol game was really being aggressive towards him and, fair play to him, he didn't shirk it or get security involved, he talked to him. He is doing all the things that Fernandes & Beard should have been doing when they were out buying rounds of drinks for fans instead of the mundane stuff that Hoos & Les do. IMO this club would be in a lot more trouble if it hadn't been for the appointment of Hoos & Ferdinand. Also, IMO he is a damned sight better person to have at QPR than Phillip Beard or Gianni Paladini ever were.
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Post by Tarbie on Feb 5, 2020 9:40:33 GMT
If what you've listed above seems like a decent return for 600k a year then I think we might as well park this conversation mate.
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Post by James1979 on Feb 5, 2020 9:52:32 GMT
Chris Ramsey seems to be fair given his experience and money in football. Have to question the Les salary given his lack of experience but I guess that’s just football. I personally don’t think a club like us who gets less than 15k fans every other week should have a director of football and manager.
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Post by Tarbie on Feb 5, 2020 9:57:52 GMT
Chris Ramsey seems to be fair given his experience and money in football. Have to question the Les salary given his lack of experience but I guess that’s just football. I personally don’t think a club like us who gets less than 15k fans every other week should have a director of football and manager. Kind of my thoughts too mate. Particularly given that we have a CEO from a financial/CFO background to manage the financial side, and a Technical Director who runs the coaching and youth set-up. Half the responsibilities that Esox has listed above make Les sound like not much more than an overpaid/glorified Club Ambassador, which is basically what I feel he has becomes in recent years since we toned down our ambitions a bit.
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Post by gtleighsr3 on Feb 5, 2020 10:00:55 GMT
Its life folks,always more chiefs in the office than grafters on the floor.
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Post by croydoncaptainjack on Feb 5, 2020 10:16:14 GMT
When you see what the likes of Conti picked up in severance pay this pales into insignificance.
I am not saying they are not overpaid but that applies to a hell of a lot of people.
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Post by Stanley75 on Feb 5, 2020 10:37:16 GMT
When you see what the likes of Conti picked up in severance pay this pales into insignificance. I am not saying they are not overpaid but that applies to a hell of a lot of people. So because it happens elsewhere that makes it ok then? And is Conti/Chelsea a fair comparison anyway? Furthermore the argument here isn't just if he's overpaid, but whether the role is actually warranted presently for a club of our size, income and other staff in existing senior positions. Or perhaps the issue here is NOT that he doesn't do a important job for the club but that his salary doesn't justify that work given the club's financial situation. Let's say hypothetically we got rid of Les and brought in another DoF but on a CR type salary (assuming LF wouldn't accept such a pay cut), would that be better for the club, particularly considering his workload is probably lower now than prior to all the restructuring work?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 5, 2020 10:50:06 GMT
Conte won the league and fa cup in his 2 seasons so you could argue he earned that money?
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Post by esoxlucius on Feb 5, 2020 11:06:24 GMT
If what you've listed above seems like a decent return for 600k a year then I think we might as well park this conversation mate. We could have David DeGea for 11 days for the same money. Or Jack Wilshire for ten weeks.
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Post by croydoncaptainjack on Feb 5, 2020 11:15:59 GMT
When you see what the likes of Conti picked up in severance pay this pales into insignificance. I am not saying they are not overpaid but that applies to a hell of a lot of people. So because it happens elsewhere that makes it ok then? And is Conti/Chelsea a fair comparison anyway? Furthermore the argument here isn't just if he's overpaid, but whether the role is actually warranted presently for a club of our size, income and other staff in existing senior positions. Or perhaps the issue here is NOT that he doesn't do a important job for the club but that his salary doesn't justify that work given the club's financial situation. Let's say hypothetically we got rid of Les and brought in another DoF but on a CR type salary (assuming LF wouldn't accept such a pay cut), would that be better for the club, particularly considering his workload is probably lower now than prior to all the restructuring work? I think they are both doing a good job so I am probably not the right person to ask. Good people cost a lot of money generally.
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Post by shepherdsmush on Feb 5, 2020 11:17:37 GMT
To be fair, someone has to find these players and then persuade them to leave Liverpool, Spurs, Lierse, etc.
As we NEED to invest in youth, the set up is vital for us and LF (and CR) has helped create a club that decent youth players genuinely do want to join.
The salary of the to brass is a lot but if we get the set-up right and move forward as a club into the PL OR produce valuable players then it is a drop in the ocean
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Post by croydoncaptainjack on Feb 5, 2020 11:17:37 GMT
Conte won the league and fa cup in his 2 seasons so you could argue he earned that money? You could but it was rumoured to be £26m so I was trying to get some perspective.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 5, 2020 11:26:23 GMT
Conte won the league and fa cup in his 2 seasons so you could argue he earned that money? You could but it was rumoured to be £26m so I was trying to get some perspective. CCJ when since 2004 has perspective and Chelsea gone hand in hand.
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Post by croydoncaptainjack on Feb 5, 2020 12:44:18 GMT
You could but it was rumoured to be £26m so I was trying to get some perspective. CCJ when since 2004 has perspective and Chelsea gone hand in hand. Good point, well made.
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Post by Tarbie on Feb 5, 2020 13:22:31 GMT
If what you've listed above seems like a decent return for 600k a year then I think we might as well park this conversation mate. We could have David DeGea for 11 days for the same money. Or Jack Wilshire for ten weeks. No we couldn't, as they wouldn't come to QPR. But what we could genuinely have for 600k a year is 1 decent, established Championship standard player or 2-3 decent youngsters.
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Post by esoxlucius on Feb 5, 2020 13:54:04 GMT
We could have David DeGea for 11 days for the same money. Or Jack Wilshire for ten weeks. No we couldn't, as they wouldn't come to QPR. But what we could genuinely have for 600k a year is 1 decent, established Championship standard player or 2-3 decent youngsters. How do we know that the established Championship standard player or 2-3 decent youngsters that we already have at the club aren't as a result of Les' charisma and status in the game?
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Post by alanwycombe on Feb 5, 2020 14:08:59 GMT
But as a club we not skint,bills are paid etc,we cant spend lots ok but can spend. Skit is like Bolton. But the club can't stand on its own and relying on effectively the goodwill of the owners etc. (yes I'm sure there's a long game here) means we are skint. A club like us can't afford luxury items like a DOF when the whole theory is flawed anyway - the continuity idea never happens. JFH to H to Schteve to MW...all different. We've got Coaching staff, presumably we scout, financial people running the business, so why a DOF? I've never slagged our owners as we wouldn't be here now having poured so much money down the drain if they had pissed off.
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